Overrun on a walk

  • Can a runner in little league overrun or over slide at first base and not get called out on a tag?

    I know all the other leagues you do get called out.

    Thank You



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  • Yes. In any OBR based rules set, you are allowed to overrun first on a walk (subject to the same caveats as if the ball were hit).

  • MLB:

    Rule 6.08(a) Comment: A batter who is entitled to first base because of a base on balls must go to first base and touch the base before other base runners are forced to advance. This applies when bases are full and applies when a substitute runner is put into the game.

    If, in advancing, the base runner thinks there is a play and he slides past the base before or after touching it he may be put out by the fielder tagging him. If he fails to touch the base to which he is entitled and attempts to advance beyond that base he may be put out by tagging him or the base he missed.

    High School Fed:

    8-2-7:

    A batter-runner who reaches first base safely and the overruns or overslides may immediately return without liability of being put out provided he does not attempt or feint an advance to second. A player who is awarded first base on a base on balls does not have this right.

  • In LL you can overrun 1B on a BB.

    From the LLRIM after 6.08(a):

    INSTRUCTOR COMMENTS:

    Remember, the batter-runner is permitted to overrun first base on a base on balls. This provision, however, does not apply to other runners advancing to second or third bases.

  • Michael, in LL you may overrun 1st on a walk.

  • In pro ball you may overrun on a walk.

    In any OBR rule based game you may overrun on a walk.

    In NCAA you may overrun on a walk.

    Only FED disallows it.

  • Michael, the MLB rule you quote has nothing to do with the batter-runner overrunning first base on a walk. It's talking about other runners who are forced to advance on a walk, and if they happen to go beyond their next bases.

    Now, if the batter-runner makes an attempt to advance to second base after overrunning first on a walk, he puts himself in jeopardy, no different than if he does that on a batted ball or uncaught third strike.

  • Wow! Thank you all for your comments. I always learn so much.

    Not looking for an answer but...

    Why are rule books different?

    I understand something written for safety reasons, but why other little rules!

  • Michael, in a perfect world, each organization would use the same rulebook. Unfortunately, we're not in a perfect world and each organization does what they want. On the softball side, in some of our divisions, LL has started to mirror some of the other softball out there. So that's good for me and a lot of our softball players.

    I work LL Baseball and Softball, along with HS softball and 3 other youth organizations softball. I carry 6 different rulebooks with me and have made myself a "guide" listing some of what I consider the major differences in my travel softball organizations.

    In my opinion, at least 90% of the rules for both baseball and all my softball are the same or similar. It's those little differences that you need to look for and remember.

    During the spring/summer, the back of my car is very colorful with all my umpire shirts (Reds, Blues, Black........)

  • but why other little rules...

    In my opinion it is not the rules it is the interpretations of the rules. Little League follows OBR rule set, the same rules used in Major League Baseball. So most of the interpretations are passed along through history and MLB case studies. When a sceneaero is presented we look at the Little League Rule Interpretation Manual and then we review MLB case studies.

    Fed wrote their own rule book and Federated umpire boards have their own interpretation of what the rules state. There is one book that serves as an interpretation by Carl Childress but many FED Boards do not embrace this. Bottom line, FED has a minuscule of interpretations in comparison to OBR.

  • Michael, organizations modify their rules not only for safety, but to also accommodate the skill levels of the participants.

    One obvious example in LL is the leaving base early rule. The rule requires the runner to stay on the base until the ball reaches the batter to provide balance between the skills of the runners and those of the pitcher and catcher. Without the rule, the offense would have a huge advantage.

    Another is the pitching rule in LL softball. Pitchers in ASA must keep both feet in contact with the plate during the preliminary motions until the delivery, where the pitcher steps forward with the non-pivot foot. In LL, however, the pitcher may take a step back with that non-pivot foot. That's because many rec-ball players in LL need some help in pitching with control, and the step back gives them some more stability. Requiring those relatively lesser-skilled pitchers to stay in contact would put them at more of a disadvantage. Ironically, that's the same reason high school softball rules allow the same step-back for pitchers.

  • The NFHS's high school rules book explicitly denies overrun protection to a batter awarded first base on balls at Rule 8-2-7.

    Manny's claim that 6.08(a) does not apply to ALL runners, including the walked batter who has just become a runner, is unsupported. Manny makes no argument based in OBR language for a walked batter being entitled to putout protection if he overruns first base. No where in the OBR does it say that, that I can find. Without support in the OBR's language, he is merely repeating something others have told him, more than likely--just like the others, above, who claim that the OBR protects a walked batter who "overruns" first. Think about it; it's a ridiculous notion. Why would a runner who has been awarded first base have any need for overrun protection? Clearly, the spirit of the rule that allows it when a force out is imminent would not apply to an awarded base--all bases are equal when first base has been awarded to the batter.

    6.08 begins with, "The batter becomes a runner ... when--". Clearly, we are talking about the player who was just batting, and has been walked. 6.08(a) plainly states that that batter becomes a runner upon the fourth ball being called, so the walked batter is now considered a runner, for purposes of this rule. The first paragraph of (a)'s Comment section begins with, "A batter ...", and then distinguishes the batter, now a runner, from other runners by using the words, "... other base runners ...", so (a) is clearly also talking about the batter who just became a runner, otherwise there would be no need to say, "other" base runners. The second paragraph then reduces it to simply, "... the base runner ...", presumably meaning any runner, which we have bee told the walked batter is now one of. For Manny's reading to be correct, that second paragraph of (a)'s Comment would use the "other base runners" terminology that it previously used to tell us it only meant the other base runners--pretty simple.

    Here is the OBR language:

    6.08 The batter becomes a runner and is entitled to first base without liability to be put

    out (provided he advances to and touches first base) when—

    (a) Four “balls” have been called by the umpire;

    Rule 6.08(a) Comment: A batter who is entitled to first base because of a base on balls must

    go to first base and touch the base before other base runners are forced to advance. This applies when

    bases are full and applies when a substitute runner is put into the game.

    If, in advancing, the base runner thinks there is a play and he slides past the base before or after

    touching it he may be put out by the fielder tagging him. If he fails to touch the base to which he is entitled

    and attempts to advance beyond that base he may be put out by tagging him or the base he missed